| jelkner | here you are | 12:48 |
|---|---|---|
| jelkner | danielcammue, when i get there this summer | 12:48 |
| jelkner | i'll fix you up with a decent laptop running FREE sofwtare | 12:48 |
| jelkner | some linux distro | 12:49 |
| jelkner | and i'll show you how to use hexchat | 12:49 |
| danielcammue | Okay | 12:49 |
| jelkner | what are you using now? | 12:49 |
| danielcammue | :-) | 12:49 |
| danielcammue | I am using my phone and laptop | 12:49 |
| jelkner | what laptop? | 12:50 |
| jelkner | what OS does it have? | 12:50 |
| danielcammue | The window laptop | 12:50 |
| jelkner | The window laptop? | 12:50 |
| jelkner | so it isn't one that i brought | 12:50 |
| jelkner | is that correct? | 12:51 |
| jelkner | because i would never bring a windows laptop! ;-) | 12:51 |
| danielcammue | It is one | 12:51 |
| jelkner | then it doesn't have windows on it | 12:51 |
| danielcammue | The one that uses the magnet charger | 12:51 |
| jelkner | ahh yeah | 12:51 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 12:51 |
| danielcammue | But the window signs on it | 12:52 |
| jelkner | they are branded by Microsoft, that's true | 12:52 |
| jelkner | but i liberated them from running that evil operating system ;-) | 12:52 |
| jelkner | They are called surfaces i believe | 12:52 |
| danielcammue | Sure | 12:53 |
| jelkner | and i installed a linux distro | 12:53 |
| jelkner | i don't remember which | 12:53 |
| jelkner | but this is a good opportunity for us to talk about assests | 12:53 |
| jelkner | right? | 12:53 |
| jelkner | when we start keeping the books for Jetro Web | 12:53 |
| danielcammue | The one I have is using Linux | 12:53 |
| jelkner | the laptops that it has will all be listed as Assets | 12:54 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 12:54 |
| jelkner | in fact, i think they are the kind of assets that need to be depreciated | 12:54 |
| danielcammue | All these are our assets | 12:54 |
| danielcammue | And they will depreciate as time go by | 12:54 |
| jelkner | learning to do that will help us keep track of when they need to be replaced | 12:54 |
| jelkner | this is such a great opportunity for us to learn! | 12:55 |
| jelkner | i made a spreadsheet awhile back | 12:55 |
| danielcammue | They are fixed assets | 12:55 |
| jelkner | nice | 12:55 |
| danielcammue | They last over a year or decade | 12:55 |
| jelkner | excellent | 12:56 |
| jelkner | danielcammue, i will need to leave in 30 minutes to go to the store with my wife | 12:56 |
| jelkner | we need to get drinks for the NOVASEN dinner tonight | 12:56 |
| danielcammue | OK | 12:56 |
| jelkner | so let's figure out what we plan to do | 12:56 |
| danielcammue | Then let move on faster | 12:56 |
| jelkner | what is your schedule? | 12:56 |
| jelkner | can we meet again tomorrow at this same time? | 12:57 |
| danielcammue | So have you take a look at the book for jetroweb? | 12:57 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 12:57 |
| jelkner | perfect | 12:57 |
| danielcammue | I am free over the weeken till Tuesday | 12:57 |
| jelkner | so right now, let me see if i can connect gnucash to the jetroweb accounts | 12:57 |
| danielcammue | OK | 12:58 |
| jelkner | ok, when i launch gnucash on my home desktop | 12:59 |
| jelkner | i see it connects to the sjcompute books | 12:59 |
| jelkner | i need to look up how to connect to the jetro ones | 12:59 |
| jelkner | hold on... | 12:59 |
| danielcammue | +1 with no issues right? | 12:59 |
| danielcammue | If you come across the lock, just click "open read only" | 13:04 |
| jelkner | hmmm... I don't remember my password | 13:04 |
| jelkner | sorry about this | 13:04 |
| jelkner | i have to figure out where i put it | 13:04 |
| danielcammue | Can I give you mine | 13:04 |
| jelkner | no, we will be doing this a lot | 13:05 |
| jelkner | i need to fix this | 13:05 |
| danielcammue | Okay | 13:05 |
| jelkner | also, i have admin on the machine | 13:05 |
| jelkner | so i can just change it | 13:05 |
| danielcammue | But can you connect to novaweb | 13:05 |
| jelkner | i'm connecting to sjcompute | 13:05 |
| jelkner | actually, the password will be the same | 13:06 |
| jelkner | let me see if i can find it in gnucash | 13:06 |
| danielcammue | OK | 13:06 |
| jelkner | i'm so sorry danielcammue | 13:09 |
| jelkner | i'm wasting your time | 13:09 |
| jelkner | i need to get this together | 13:10 |
| jelkner | maybe we should make that my task for today | 13:10 |
| danielcammue | I am not busy my friend | 13:10 |
| jelkner | well, my friend, your time is valuable | 13:10 |
| danielcammue | You are the one need to get to your wife | 13:10 |
| jelkner | so i shouldn't be wasting it! | 13:10 |
| jelkner | yes, but i can work on this when we get back | 13:10 |
| jelkner | and i can be ready tomorrow | 13:11 |
| danielcammue | OK | 13:11 |
| jelkner | i noticed another thing | 13:11 |
| jelkner | i can't update the postgres server | 13:11 |
| danielcammue | What is it? | 13:11 |
| danielcammue | Hmmm | 13:11 |
| jelkner | so i need to look into that too | 13:11 |
| jelkner | i think we installed the lastest postgres from a different package repository | 13:11 |
| jelkner | and apt doesn't like it | 13:12 |
| jelkner | so i need to look into that too | 13:12 |
| danielcammue | Okay | 13:12 |
| jelkner | let's plan to meet tomorrow right after the stand up meeting | 13:12 |
| jelkner | i'll be ready by then | 13:12 |
| danielcammue | OK | 13:12 |
| danielcammue | Nice meeting | 13:12 |
| jelkner | for now, there is one thing we can do | 13:12 |
| jelkner | do you have hexchat on your laptop? | 13:13 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 13:13 |
| jelkner | So in the HexChat -> Network List menu | 13:14 |
| jelkner | you will see OFTC | 13:14 |
| jelkner | if you click "Edit..." | 13:14 |
| jelkner | You will see a tab labelled "Autojoin Channels" | 13:15 |
| jelkner | you can just add #sjcompute there | 13:15 |
| jelkner | and it will automatically join you to both #jetrowebdev and #sjcompute whenever you launch hexchat | 13:15 |
| jelkner | you should add #novawebdeve too | 13:16 |
| jelkner | and you won't need a separate user name | 13:16 |
| jelkner | you can use dcammue for all of them | 13:16 |
| danielcammue | OK | 13:16 |
| jelkner | ok, let's meet tomorrow | 13:16 |
| jelkner | wait | 13:17 |
| jelkner | oops | 13:17 |
| jelkner | one more important thing | 13:17 |
| jelkner | the office | 13:17 |
| danielcammue | Yes we are good | 13:17 |
| jelkner | what do you mean "we are good"? | 13:17 |
| danielcammue | I want to host a meeting with jetroweb to discuss when we will go and pay for the office | 13:18 |
| danielcammue | Mr. Zawolo already gave the go ahead | 13:18 |
| danielcammue | That we can pay for the place | 13:18 |
| danielcammue | So I want to host a meeting with jetroweb | 13:19 |
| jelkner | this will get *so* much easier when you and Thomas and Shallon, and Mulbah, and Janet and Gabriel, and Freena can all be together! | 13:19 |
| danielcammue | To see how best we can. Pay for it | 13:19 |
| jelkner | please do that ASAP | 13:19 |
| jelkner | what do you mean? | 13:19 |
| danielcammue | +1 my friend | 13:19 |
| jelkner | don't you have enough money in the bank? | 13:19 |
| danielcammue | I will definitely | 13:19 |
| danielcammue | We do | 13:19 |
| danielcammue | I thank | 13:19 |
| jelkner | so you just need to vote to do it, right? | 13:19 |
| danielcammue | Sorry for thT | 13:20 |
| danielcammue | *that | 13:20 |
| danielcammue | Vote? | 13:20 |
| jelkner | well, you are a co-op | 13:20 |
| jelkner | this is a big investment | 13:20 |
| danielcammue | We don't need to vote. | 13:20 |
| jelkner | seems to me this is the kind of thing the members should agree on | 13:20 |
| jelkner | but i won't get in the middle of that ;-) | 13:21 |
| jelkner | if it was nova web | 13:21 |
| jelkner | and we were going to spend a lot of our cash asset on an office | 13:21 |
| danielcammue | jelkner: | 13:21 |
| jelkner | we would need to vote ;-) | 13:21 |
| jelkner | this is another goal my dear friend | 13:21 |
| jelkner | for Jetro to become a real co-op | 13:22 |
| jelkner | you will need to begin to feel like you own it together | 13:22 |
| jelkner | that's how you'll be able to make tough decisions | 13:22 |
| jelkner | like who should be pay out of our limited resources now? | 13:22 |
| jelkner | like i mentioned, right now thomas and you are taking on most of the responsibility | 13:23 |
| jelkner | so it seems to me that you two should be paid | 13:23 |
| danielcammue | You see, the members are in agreement but they do not want to do the hard work | 13:23 |
| jelkner | but that isn't my decision in the end | 13:23 |
| jelkner | or it shouldn't be | 13:23 |
| jelkner | it should be jetro's collective decision | 13:23 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 13:23 |
| danielcammue | We had a meeting on that | 13:23 |
| danielcammue | On Monday | 13:23 |
| jelkner | oh great | 13:23 |
| danielcammue | This the link | 13:23 |
| jelkner | so glad to hear that | 13:24 |
| danielcammue | https://irclogs.novawebdevelopment.org/%23jetrowebdev/2025-11-17.log.html | 13:24 |
| jelkner | hmmmm | 13:24 |
| danielcammue | After our stand up meeting | 13:24 |
| jelkner | hold on | 13:24 |
| danielcammue | In the evening hour | 13:24 |
| jelkner | wait | 13:24 |
| jelkner | the url isn't working | 13:24 |
| jelkner | we don't have .org any more | 13:24 |
| danielcammue | OK can you check the log for monday | 13:25 |
| jelkner | i found it | 13:25 |
| danielcammue | OK | 13:25 |
| jelkner | https://irclogs.novawebdevelopment.coop/%23jetrowebdev/2025-11-17.log.html | 13:25 |
| jelkner | i'm reading now | 13:25 |
| jelkner | hold on... | 13:25 |
| jelkner | just read the logs, danielcammue | 13:28 |
| jelkner | this is great | 13:28 |
| jelkner | let's talk tomorrow | 13:28 |
| jelkner | my wife it telling me i have to go! | 13:28 |
| jelkner | see you tomorrow | 13:28 |
| jelkner | ACTION signs off until tomorrow | 13:28 |
| jelkner has quit (Quit: Leaving) | 13:28 | |
| danielcammue has left #sjcompute (None) | 14:52 | |
| danielcammue | I am in | 15:33 |
| jelkner | hello danielcammue | 15:34 |
| jelkner | great | 15:34 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 15:34 |
| jelkner | ok, i read the meeting logs | 15:34 |
| jelkner | since you are now the other full time staffer | 15:34 |
| jelkner | can you use the same schedule we set for thomas? | 15:34 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 15:34 |
| jelkner | Mon, Wed, Fri, Sat, Sun | 15:35 |
| jelkner | since zOnny starts at 7 am EST | 15:35 |
| jelkner | and since our stand up meetings mon, wed, and fri are 7 am EST | 15:35 |
| danielcammue | One good thing I am free all along these scheduled | 15:36 |
| jelkner | which is 12 noon your time | 15:36 |
| danielcammue | So it will be great | 15:36 |
| jelkner | you may want to plan your day around that | 15:36 |
| jelkner | start at around 11 am your time | 15:36 |
| jelkner | and work until 7 pm your time | 15:37 |
| danielcammue | OK | 15:37 |
| jelkner | we are a co-op | 15:37 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 15:37 |
| jelkner | we get to set our own schedules | 15:37 |
| jelkner | but we need to set schedules that serve our business needs | 15:37 |
| jelkner | so that is the main constraint we have to operate under | 15:37 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 15:38 |
| jelkner | most weekends i will be at the sat and sun stand up meetings | 15:38 |
| jelkner | some days i'll be able to stay and work | 15:38 |
| jelkner | others i'll have to leave | 15:38 |
| jelkner | to attend other meetings and such | 15:38 |
| jelkner | ok, i have a question for you | 15:38 |
| danielcammue | OK | 15:39 |
| jelkner | where can i put a pdf file that you'll be able to download? | 15:39 |
| danielcammue | Go ahead | 15:39 |
| jelkner | i just did ;-) | 15:39 |
| danielcammue | Next cloud | 15:39 |
| jelkner | since i don't have rights to this file | 15:39 |
| jelkner | i'd rather not do that | 15:39 |
| jelkner | do you have ssh access to any servers? | 15:40 |
| danielcammue | Hmm no | 15:40 |
| jelkner | np | 15:40 |
| danielcammue | I need to ask thomasboimah | 15:40 |
| jelkner | i'm glad you're the other full time person now, danielcammue | 15:40 |
| jelkner | since i will want to teach you basic linux cli | 15:40 |
| jelkner | we all need to have those basic skills | 15:41 |
| jelkner | if we are going to be a free software focused web tech coop | 15:41 |
| jelkner | co-op | 15:41 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 15:41 |
| jelkner | so hold on, let me ask thomas now... | 15:41 |
| jelkner | brb | 15:41 |
| jelkner | wait | 15:41 |
| jelkner | he's in the middle of a discussion with zOnny | 15:42 |
| jelkner | i don't want to disturb them | 15:42 |
| jelkner | let me figure this out | 15:42 |
| danielcammue | OK | 15:42 |
| jelkner | what is your username on your laptop? | 15:43 |
| danielcammue | dcammue | 15:43 |
| jelkner | perfect | 15:43 |
| jelkner | give me a minute | 15:43 |
| jelkner | do you have an ssh public key? | 15:44 |
| jelkner | do you know what that is? | 15:45 |
| jelkner | if not, i'll explain | 15:45 |
| danielcammue | No | 15:45 |
| jelkner | No what? | 15:45 |
| jelkner | No you don't have one, or no you don't know what it is? | 15:46 |
| danielcammue | I don't have ssh public key | 15:46 |
| jelkner | do you know what it is? | 15:46 |
| danielcammue | I don't no either | 15:46 |
| jelkner | then how do you know you don't have one? | 15:46 |
| jelkner | LOL | 15:46 |
| jelkner | do you know how to use the terminal, danielcammue? | 15:47 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 15:47 |
| jelkner | ok, let's start there | 15:47 |
| jelkner | launch your terminal app | 15:47 |
| jelkner | tell me when you're ready... | 15:48 |
| jelkner | ACTION thinks it's taking danielcammue a loong time to launch his terminal app | 15:49 |
| danielcammue | Just few minutes. I am away from my machine | 15:49 |
| jelkner | ah, you need to be on your machine, danielcammue | 15:49 |
| jelkner | how will we use gnucash together if you aren't on your machine? | 15:50 |
| danielcammue | ACTION goes get his machine in 5 minutes | 15:50 |
| jelkner | got you | 15:50 |
| jelkner | i'll go work on something lese | 15:50 |
| jelkner | else | 15:50 |
| jelkner | let me know when you're ready... | 15:50 |
| jelkner | danielcammue, any word? | 15:59 |
| jelkner | it's been 10 minutes ;-) | 15:59 |
| danielcammue | ACTION booting his machine. Jelkner can now come back | 15:59 |
| jelkner | cool | 16:00 |
| jelkner | let me know when you have a terminal | 16:00 |
| danielcammue | Let begin | 16:02 |
| jelkner | run: ls -a | 16:02 |
| jelkner | tell me if you see a .ssh directory | 16:02 |
| danielcammue | I saw a lot | 16:03 |
| danielcammue | Of ssh directory | 16:03 |
| jelkner | yes, but i'm only interested if .ssh is amonght the "a lot" | 16:03 |
| jelkner | ? | 16:03 |
| jelkner | the command ls lists files and directories in your current working directory | 16:04 |
| danielcammue | Non | 16:04 |
| danielcammue | None | 16:04 |
| jelkner | ls -a | 16:04 |
| jelkner | lists the files and directories that start with . | 16:04 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 16:04 |
| jelkner | otherwise, those won't be listed | 16:05 |
| danielcammue | I see them | 16:05 |
| danielcammue | But .ssh is not among | 16:05 |
| jelkner | sweet | 16:05 |
| jelkner | ok, now run the following command, and then just keep hitting Enter when it asks you questions: | 16:05 |
| jelkner | ssh-keygen | 16:05 |
| jelkner | tell me when you're done | 16:06 |
| danielcammue | I see enter passphrase | 16:07 |
| jelkner | just hit enter | 16:08 |
| danielcammue | And other lines | 16:08 |
| jelkner | don't put a passphrase | 16:08 |
| jelkner | like i said | 16:08 |
| jelkner | just keep hitting enter | 16:08 |
| jelkner | nothing else | 16:08 |
| jelkner | let me know when you get your $ prompt back | 16:08 |
| jelkner | that means you're finished | 16:08 |
| jelkner | and you'll have an ssh key | 16:08 |
| danielcammue | I hit and I saw a box like at the end with RSA 3072 at the top and SHA256 at the bottom | 16:09 |
| jelkner | nice | 16:09 |
| jelkner | ok, now run ls -a again | 16:09 |
| jelkner | you will see a .ssh directory | 16:09 |
| jelkner | please confirm | 16:09 |
| danielcammue | I got .ssh | 16:10 |
| jelkner | sweat | 16:10 |
| jelkner | type cd .ssh | 16:10 |
| jelkner | then type ls and tell me what you see | 16:10 |
| danielcammue | Id_rsa id_rsa.pub | 16:11 |
| jelkner | excellent | 16:11 |
| jelkner | the one named id_rsa.pub is your public key | 16:11 |
| danielcammue | OK | 16:12 |
| jelkner | i need what's in that file | 16:12 |
| jelkner | let's think about how to get it to me | 16:12 |
| jelkner | you could just run: | 16:12 |
| jelkner | cat id_rsa.pub | 16:12 |
| jelkner | and copy and paste what you see in the terminal | 16:12 |
| jelkner | or, you could upload that file to nextcloud | 16:13 |
| jelkner | which ever will be easiest for you | 16:13 |
| jelkner | but make sure it it the .pub one! | 16:14 |
| jelkner | the other one is your *private* key | 16:14 |
| jelkner | don't share that | 16:14 |
| jelkner | the .pub you can share with anyone | 16:14 |
| jelkner | it is your "public" key | 16:14 |
| danielcammue | Should I past it here? | 16:15 |
| jelkner | sure | 16:15 |
| danielcammue | ssh-rsa | 16:15 |
| danielcammue | AAAAB3NzaC1yc2EAAAADAQABAAABgQCS13QuVLXKymKOqXz+N1HDGtqfsMniOKC72vs+DvnITjBnMrAXV9DOmEwjj5Yk/dqcqEyAxLuU+FV9Giz1IlleroxJ/eW3xJWDhhCRo5wVOkyb2z7Z0hsu0VXPnT1n6sgn764r9RYK0C/v/xZbx1CL9Adr4am+imrVr9L3x1fJxqYxo1fbbFA+zYaImk7GwrlVmh8uhzEURfMWHX/i27SAmrbZ83FAsZL0GzHxegBM58mjC4zTpBRos7wrPXpBiuSZamHs+yWTMIiLs87cNECVeYenj1dvu67Jkpf75NXT0OlSjMG8ewNqxFNDSVu0UdJlpJzTdq1JTQs/rcSkL3eJ8mguZ9Pu1/ti7+X+Nie64ZNxO+qnepPL54IJYC91zfMxeXc66C05Xv0B2 | 16:15 |
| danielcammue | RQF9PR2BELFdL28qladzY0nZCv1s5BUBI05JyZXeJOIikAeBYYOEJjazIrOoWzKc6+m4ogEo57p1/ZGf2T1o8uEpwF3KQ2Avl7nu26QoI7oxHPrkhc= dcammue@jetroweb3 | 16:15 |
| jelkner | now try this: | 16:17 |
| jelkner | ssh postgresql.sjcompute.org | 16:17 |
| jelkner | and tell me what happens | 16:18 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:19 |
| danielcammue | Asking me if I want to continue connecting | 16:19 |
| jelkner | type yes | 16:19 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:20 |
| danielcammue | I see permanently added postgresql.sjcompute.org to the list of known host | 16:21 |
| jelkner | nice! | 16:21 |
| jelkner | did it let you in after that? | 16:21 |
| jelkner | you should see the prompt change to dcammue@postgresql | 16:22 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:23 |
| danielcammue | Nope. I did not see thst | 16:23 |
| danielcammue | *that | 16:24 |
| jelkner | what happened? | 16:24 |
| jelkner | it will either give you permission denied | 16:24 |
| jelkner | or let you in | 16:24 |
| jelkner | one or the other | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | Warning: Permanently added 'postgresql.sjcompute.org' (ED25519) to the list of known hosts. | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | Linux postgresql 6.1.0-41-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT_DYNAMIC Debian 6.1.158-1 (2025-11-09) x86_64 | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | The programs included with the Debian GNU/Linux system are free software; | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | the exact distribution terms for each program are described in the | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | individual files in /usr/share/doc/*/copyright. | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | Debian GNU/Linux comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY, to the extent | 16:24 |
| danielcammue | permitted by applicable law. | 16:24 |
| jelkner | ok, that's good | 16:24 |
| jelkner | but you now have a prompt again, yes? | 16:25 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 16:25 |
| jelkner | what does your prompt look like>? | 16:25 |
| jelkner | look like? | 16:25 |
| danielcammue | I am in | 16:26 |
| danielcammue | Got it | 16:26 |
| jelkner | sweet | 16:26 |
| danielcammue | :-) | 16:26 |
| jelkner | nice! | 16:26 |
| jelkner | type ls and tell me what you see | 16:26 |
| danielcammue | The AccountingGame.pdf | 16:27 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:27 |
| jelkner | yes! | 16:27 |
| jelkner | perfect!! | 16:27 |
| jelkner | ok, let's get that onto your local commuputer | 16:27 |
| jelkner | then i can give you your assignment | 16:28 |
| jelkner | and we can logoff | 16:28 |
| jelkner | type exit | 16:28 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 16:28 |
| jelkner | to log out from the remote machine | 16:28 |
| jelkner | then type: | 16:28 |
| jelkner | scp postgresql.sjcompute.org:TheAccountingGame.pdf . | 16:29 |
| jelkner | that should copy the pdf file to your local machine | 16:29 |
| jelkner | please confirm | 16:29 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:32 |
| danielcammue | https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/k8ayQH6W | 16:33 |
| jelkner | ok, did you put the "." at the end? | 16:33 |
| jelkner | scp from to | 16:33 |
| jelkner | scp is "secure copy" | 16:34 |
| danielcammue | Nope | 16:34 |
| jelkner | well that's the problem i bet ;-) | 16:34 |
| danielcammue | Should I? | 16:34 |
| jelkner | you need from and to | 16:34 |
| jelkner | to tell the copy program what to copy | 16:34 |
| jelkner | and where | 16:34 |
| jelkner | so from in this case is: postgresql.sjcompute.org:TheAccountingGame.pdf | 16:35 |
| jelkner | the "to" in this case is your current working directory | 16:35 |
| jelkner | which has the very convenient short name of "." | 16:35 |
| jelkner | if you were using hexchat | 16:35 |
| jelkner | on your laptop | 16:36 |
| jelkner | you could have just copied and pasted that ;-) | 16:36 |
| jelkner | scp postgresql.sjcompute.org:TheAccountingGame.pdf . | 16:36 |
| jelkner | there is a . at the end | 16:36 |
| jelkner | you need the whole line | 16:36 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:38 |
| danielcammue | Let connect to hexchat | 16:39 |
| jelkner | connect with hexchat | 16:39 |
| jelkner | ok, i'll wait for you here | 16:39 |
| jelkner | don't take too long | 16:39 |
| jelkner | i have a lot to do today | 16:39 |
| jelkner | actually danielcammue you could just use your browser | 16:40 |
| jelkner | and copy and paste from the irc logs | 16:41 |
| jelkner | https://irclogs.novawebdevelopment.coop/%23sjcompute/2025-11-22.log.html | 16:41 |
| jelkner | well dcammue_? | 16:44 |
| danielcammue | Can you type one more time? | 16:44 |
| jelkner | scp postgresql.sjcompute.org:TheAccountingGame.pdf . | 16:44 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:46 |
| jelkner | dcammue_, you're still logged into the server | 16:48 |
| jelkner | it won't work | 16:48 |
| danielcammue | Permission denied | 16:48 |
| jelkner | you need to be on your local machine | 16:48 |
| jelkner | that can't be right | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | dcammue@postgresql:~$ scp postgresql.sjcompute.org:TheAccountingGame.pdf . | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | The authenticity of host 'postgresql.sjcompute.org (173.255.235.141)' can't be established. | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | ED25519 key fingerprint is SHA256:E+OfMyVxTFSx3RqhKpZcdGHapK901FTs7Y9aagRAv9w. | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | This key is not known by any other names. | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | Are you sure you want to continue connecting (yes/no/[fingerprint])? yes | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | Warning: Permanently added 'postgresql.sjcompute.org' (ED25519) to the list of known hosts. | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | dcammue@postgresql.sjcompute.org: Permission denied (publickey). | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | scp: Connection closed | 16:49 |
| dcammue_ | dcammue@postgresql:~$ | 16:49 |
| jelkner | you aren't getting me | 16:49 |
| jelkner | and this is a learning opportunity | 16:49 |
| jelkner | so even though it is taking a lot of time | 16:49 |
| jelkner | it's worth it for today | 16:49 |
| jelkner | but we need to get you all in an office ASAP! | 16:50 |
| jelkner | so you can teach each other | 16:50 |
| jelkner | i can't spend hours on this | 16:50 |
| jelkner | ok, here is the deal | 16:50 |
| jelkner | there are TWO computers | 16:50 |
| jelkner | one you are touching | 16:50 |
| jelkner | your laptop | 16:50 |
| jelkner | and one that is somewhere on the Internet. | 16:50 |
| jelkner | I don't know where | 16:50 |
| jelkner | that is postgresql.sjcompute.org | 16:51 |
| jelkner | do you see the prompt at the end of what you pasted? | 16:51 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 16:51 |
| jelkner | it says: dcammue@postgresql | 16:51 |
| jelkner | so which maching is that? | 16:51 |
| jelkner | hint: it is *not* your laptop! ;-) | 16:52 |
| danielcammue | My computer | 16:52 |
| jelkner | which is named jetro3 | 16:52 |
| jelkner | no! | 16:52 |
| danielcammue | Mine | 16:52 |
| jelkner | no! | 16:52 |
| jelkner | your machine is named jetro3 | 16:52 |
| jelkner | the prompt would say: | 16:52 |
| jelkner | dcammue@jetro3 | 16:52 |
| jelkner | not | 16:52 |
| jelkner | dcammue@postgresql | 16:52 |
| danielcammue | Which machine is that? | 16:53 |
| jelkner | that is the machine on the Internet | 16:53 |
| danielcammue | Okay | 16:53 |
| jelkner | postgresql.sjcompute.org | 16:53 |
| jelkner | you missed my instruction to type "exit" | 16:53 |
| jelkner | which will log you out | 16:53 |
| jelkner | then your prompt will change to | 16:53 |
| jelkner | dcammue@jetro3 | 16:54 |
| jelkner | and you will be back on your local machine | 16:54 |
| jelkner | well? | 16:55 |
| jelkner | it looks like you logged out | 16:56 |
| jelkner | i can see it | 16:56 |
| jelkner | so that's good | 16:56 |
| jelkner | now you should have the prompt | 16:56 |
| jelkner | dcammue@jetro3 | 16:56 |
| jelkner | and you should copy and past the command there | 16:56 |
| jelkner | scp postgresql.sjcompute.org:TheAccountingGame.pdf . | 16:57 |
| jelkner | and it should copy the pdf file to your laptop | 16:57 |
| jelkner | well dcammue_? | 16:57 |
| danielcammue | It is downloading | 16:58 |
| jelkner | sweet! | 16:58 |
| jelkner | ok, success | 16:59 |
| danielcammue | Sorry, I wasted lot of time | 16:59 |
| jelkner | now let's finish up here | 16:59 |
| jelkner | np danielcammue | 16:59 |
| danielcammue | By now we gone far | 16:59 |
| jelkner | yes, but let's look at our story today | 16:59 |
| jelkner | good news: | 16:59 |
| danielcammue | Yes | 16:59 |
| jelkner | we succeeded | 16:59 |
| danielcammue | Done | 16:59 |
| jelkner | bad news: it took us 90 minutes for something that should have taken 3 minutes | 16:59 |
| jelkner | we want to win, right? | 17:00 |
| jelkner | so we need to learn to pass the ball down the field quickly and smoothly and shoot to score! | 17:00 |
| jelkner | are you with me? | 17:00 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 17:01 |
| jelkner | so let me tell you why i wanted you to have that file | 17:01 |
| jelkner | and then we can finish up | 17:01 |
| danielcammue | OK | 17:01 |
| jelkner | i'll be teaching basic accounting to my students | 17:01 |
| jelkner | you can see my lessons each week on the website cjones and i use | 17:02 |
| jelkner | here is the one for this week: | 17:02 |
| jelkner | https://ict.gracehopper.center/f25/courses/entrepreneurship/goals/week13.html | 17:02 |
| jelkner | i needed to find the best resource i could so that my students can be successful | 17:02 |
| jelkner | The Accounting Game is the best that I could find | 17:03 |
| jelkner | though it has its problems | 17:03 |
| danielcammue | Great | 17:03 |
| jelkner | i talked with my students about those problems | 17:03 |
| jelkner | and i'd like to share them with you too | 17:03 |
| jelkner | before we start using that resources | 17:03 |
| danielcammue | OK | 17:03 |
| jelkner | What do I like about the book? | 17:03 |
| jelkner | Well, it uses humor and a concrete story to teach advanced concepts | 17:04 |
| jelkner | that's the good news | 17:04 |
| jelkner | What don't I like about the book? | 17:04 |
| jelkner | Or to be more accurate, what do I *hate* about it? | 17:04 |
| jelkner | Well, let me ask another question. | 17:05 |
| jelkner | What made the United States the richest country in the world in the 20th century? | 17:05 |
| jelkner | Answer: | 17:05 |
| danielcammue | Assets | 17:05 |
| danielcammue | Or wealth | 17:06 |
| jelkner | The racist murdering thieves that ran the country stole wealth from everyone else. | 17:06 |
| jelkner | so the white racist capitalist got rich | 17:06 |
| jelkner | and the native american folks got dead | 17:06 |
| jelkner | and the African slaves got their labor stole | 17:07 |
| jelkner | and the Mexican, Chinese, etc. immigrant laborers got their labor stole too | 17:07 |
| jelkner | and the rule is here in the U.S. that capitalism is our religion | 17:08 |
| jelkner | and we *never* question it | 17:08 |
| jelkner | so this book has all of those problems | 17:08 |
| jelkner | it talks about kids growing up in a suburban house with a garage and assumes that they have the personal experience of setting up a lemonade stand | 17:09 |
| jelkner | the students in my class are mostly Latin American | 17:09 |
| jelkner | hardly any of them had a house with a garage when they grew up | 17:10 |
| jelkner | so, i want to write my own book on this stuff | 17:10 |
| jelkner | but i can't this year | 17:10 |
| danielcammue | OK | 17:10 |
| jelkner | that will have to wait for a few years from now | 17:10 |
| jelkner | and maybe, my dear friend, you can help write it with me | 17:10 |
| jelkner | we need a bookkeeping book for the solidarity economy | 17:11 |
| jelkner | that tells a story related to that | 17:11 |
| danielcammue | So that is what you hit about the book? | 17:11 |
| danielcammue | OK jelkner | 17:11 |
| jelkner | anyway, for now we will use this book | 17:11 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 17:11 |
| danielcammue | But one more thing | 17:11 |
| jelkner | since it is the best of all the terrible books and videos etc. out there | 17:12 |
| jelkner | go for it | 17:12 |
| danielcammue | I don't see the file among my files | 17:12 |
| danielcammue | From my floders | 17:12 |
| jelkner | it is probably in your Downloads directory | 17:12 |
| jelkner | and then i have one more thing too | 17:13 |
| jelkner | did you find it? | 17:14 |
| danielcammue | Go ahead | 17:14 |
| danielcammue | Not yet | 17:14 |
| jelkner | i can give you another command to run if you didn't | 17:14 |
| jelkner | run this: | 17:14 |
| jelkner | find . -iname "TheAccountingGame.pdf" | 17:15 |
| jelkner | copy and paste that into the terminal | 17:15 |
| jelkner | well? | 17:17 |
| dcammue_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) | 17:18 | |
| jelkner | well? | 17:19 |
| danielcammue | Hmm | 17:19 |
| danielcammue | Seem like I have to login | 17:19 |
| jelkner | i don't understand | 17:19 |
| jelkner | anyway, danielcammue | 17:19 |
| danielcammue | To the ssh directory | 17:19 |
| jelkner | no! | 17:19 |
| danielcammue | Let finished | 17:19 |
| jelkner | the pdf is pretty big | 17:20 |
| jelkner | and you do need to let it finish copying | 17:20 |
| jelkner | or it won't be on your local computer | 17:20 |
| jelkner | ok, i need to go | 17:20 |
| jelkner | i have other work i have to do before our NOVASEN dinner | 17:20 |
| jelkner | let me finish with a few tasks for you | 17:21 |
| jelkner | 1. You need to get an office for Jetro ASAP!!!!! | 17:21 |
| jelkner | once we have an office | 17:21 |
| jelkner | Mulbah can teach you basic unix | 17:21 |
| jelkner | and help with things like downloading this pdf that we just spent 2 hours doing | 17:21 |
| jelkner | you will be able to teach each other | 17:22 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 17:22 |
| jelkner | and your skills will grow fast enough to make Jetro a success | 17:22 |
| jelkner | so we need the office for sure | 17:22 |
| jelkner | the other two things to do: | 17:22 |
| jelkner | 2. Read The Accounting Game so you and i can use a shared resource to talk about our bookkeeping study | 17:23 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 17:23 |
| jelkner | 3. Try to improve the descriptions you put in Gnucash for transactions | 17:24 |
| jelkner | let me try to make that concrete with a few examples... | 17:24 |
| jelkner | I see: | 17:24 |
| jelkner | "salaries expense vai ATM WITHDRAW" | 17:25 |
| jelkner | not super helpful | 17:25 |
| jelkner | who is it for? | 17:25 |
| jelkner | there are lots of these exact same descriptions | 17:25 |
| jelkner | let's think about what our books are for | 17:26 |
| jelkner | they are to tell us our "finanical story" | 17:26 |
| jelkner | so we can think about the business | 17:26 |
| jelkner | Jetro Web | 17:26 |
| jelkner | and what money it is receiving (from whom and for what) | 17:26 |
| jelkner | and what money it is spending (to whom and for what) | 17:27 |
| jelkner | looking at our books should tell us that story | 17:27 |
| jelkner | we should be able to read it like a story | 17:27 |
| jelkner | $100 paid to Thomas for work on the ToDo app | 17:28 |
| danielcammue | Sure | 17:28 |
| jelkner | stuff like that | 17:28 |
| jelkner | part of the problem with a "Salary" | 17:28 |
| jelkner | is it makes it hard to figure out what we are doing | 17:28 |
| jelkner | so even if we agree we are paying you and Thomas a "salary" of $400 per month | 17:29 |
| jelkner | you should begin "itemizing" what you are doing with your salary | 17:29 |
| jelkner | maybe start by paying yourselves weekly | 17:29 |
| jelkner | and include a description of what you did that week that stands out | 17:30 |
| jelkner | "$100 paid to Daniel for setting up the Gnucash books to tell the Jetro story" | 17:30 |
| jelkner | ;-) | 17:30 |
| danielcammue | So it should be like. "Salaries expense for Thomas: September " | 17:30 |
| danielcammue | :-) | 17:30 |
| jelkner | sure, that's fine | 17:30 |
| jelkner | or it's better | 17:30 |
| jelkner | but still, does it tell us what Thomas did to earn that salary? | 17:31 |
| jelkner | if we can't use our books to understand our business | 17:31 |
| jelkner | we won't be able to make the business earn enough money to keep y'all alive | 17:31 |
| jelkner | we need to know what is coming in, and what is going out | 17:31 |
| jelkner | and why | 17:31 |
| jelkner | does that make sense? | 17:31 |
| jelkner | i don't know how to do this | 17:32 |
| jelkner | i just know that we need to figure it out together | 17:32 |
| danielcammue | You are right, because my instructor told me that the description help those that do understand accounting to read your report well | 17:32 |
| jelkner | yes | 17:32 |
| jelkner | that's what we need | 17:32 |
| danielcammue | OK | 17:32 |
| jelkner | we are doing Managerial Accounting here | 17:32 |
| jelkner | i've been learning this year | 17:33 |
| jelkner | and i'm starting to get it | 17:33 |
| jelkner | a little bit | 17:33 |
| jelkner | i mean | 17:33 |
| jelkner | there are three broad types of accounting | 17:33 |
| danielcammue | Sure | 17:33 |
| jelkner | each one has a different audience | 17:33 |
| jelkner | they are: | 17:33 |
| danielcammue | Public accounting | 17:34 |
| danielcammue | Financial accounting | 17:34 |
| jelkner | 1. Financial Accounting - for investors, and using GAAP as the reporting standard | 17:34 |
| danielcammue | Sure | 17:34 |
| jelkner | 2. Tax Accounting - for the government, and in the U.S. using the IRC (Internal Revenue Codes) as the required reporting standard | 17:35 |
| jelkner | 3. Managerial Accounting - for us, using whatever format we want, since it is for our benefit in running our business | 17:35 |
| jelkner | I don't know which one of those would be "Public Accounting" | 17:36 |
| jelkner | but thinking about why we do it | 17:36 |
| jelkner | which requires thinking about who it is for | 17:36 |
| jelkner | is really helpful | 17:36 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 17:36 |
| jelkner | so our focus now is on Managerial Accounting | 17:36 |
| jelkner | and Tax Accounting, since we will need to file taxes soon | 17:37 |
| jelkner | we don't have any investors | 17:37 |
| jelkner | i talked to my students about the incentives to lie in two of these | 17:37 |
| jelkner | you want to look good to investors and you want to look bad (poor) to the government | 17:38 |
| jelkner | you want to be honest when reporting to yourself | 17:38 |
| jelkner | assuming you want to succeed ;-) | 17:38 |
| danielcammue | Sure | 17:38 |
| jelkner | since you need the "real story" to make good decisions | 17:38 |
| jelkner | anyway i need to go | 17:38 |
| jelkner | try to keep this discussion in mind as you work on the books | 17:38 |
| danielcammue | Thanks for the return | 17:39 |
| danielcammue | Yes. I will | 17:39 |
| jelkner | i want to be able to load the gnucash data | 17:39 |
| jelkner | and have it tell me a story of Jetro's business operations | 17:39 |
| jelkner | what is coming in from whom | 17:39 |
| jelkner | what is going out for what | 17:39 |
| danielcammue | And to whom? | 17:40 |
| jelkner | you and i will be learning this together my friend | 17:40 |
| jelkner | and the sooner we can the better | 17:40 |
| danielcammue | I got you | 17:40 |
| jelkner | you have more time than i do | 17:40 |
| danielcammue | +1 | 17:40 |
| jelkner | so i am really hoping you will start teaching me! | 17:40 |
| dcammue_ has quit (Ping timeout: 480 seconds) | 17:40 | |
| danielcammue | :-) | 17:41 |
| jelkner | okie dokie, we don't need to meet tomorrow | 17:41 |
| danielcammue | Definitely | 17:41 |
| danielcammue | Alright, | 17:41 |
| jelkner | except at the stand up meeting | 17:41 |
| jelkner | then i need to do teacher work | 17:41 |
| danielcammue | OK | 17:41 |
| jelkner | ok, my friend | 17:41 |
| jelkner | talk to you tomorrow at 12 noon your time | 17:41 |
| danielcammue | I will keep those advise in mind | 17:41 |
| danielcammue | Tomorrow? | 17:42 |
| jelkner | stand up meeting | 17:42 |
| jelkner | yes | 17:42 |
| jelkner | you are a full timer | 17:42 |
| danielcammue | Oh okay | 17:42 |
| danielcammue | I got you | 17:42 |
| jelkner | you and Thomas should both attend the Sat and Sun meetings | 17:42 |
| danielcammue | I am on path | 17:42 |
| jelkner | sweet! | 17:42 |
| jelkner | gotta go... | 17:43 |
| danielcammue | Thanks for the return | 17:43 |
| jelkner | ACTION logs off until tomorrow | 17:43 |
| danielcammue | You made my day :-) | 17:43 |
| jelkner has quit (Quit: Leaving) | 17:43 | |
| danielcammue has left #sjcompute (None) | 17:43 | |
| danielcammue has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity) | 23:46 | |
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